102 - Brea
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Speaker: [00:00:00] It has never been a better time to step into the biggest visions that you have for your life. Really get going on those takes a a different approach, and I am here for that. Me and all the amazing guests on The Unboxable Podcast are navigating different ways to connect, to heal, to thrive.
I'm drawing from years in somatic therapy practice, two black belts, a whole heap of lived experience healing from adversity, and moving through big life things to get to who I really am and who I wanna be in the world. Welcome to The Unboxable Podcast.
[00:01:00]
Alena: Bree Sega is a mental retreat facilitator, writer, and host of the podcast Beneath the Story. For more than two decades, that's not a short time, she has explored questions of leadership, self-trust, relationships, meaningful change, and what it means to build a life that feels authentic and our own.
We're gonna get along just fine, Bree.
Brea: I know. I looked at your website. I was like, "Okay, there's a lot of..." '
I was like, "All right. Okay."
Alena: Wanna formally welcome you to the podcast now. And I wanna say- how thrilled I am to have you here, and I'm just so excited to get into a few of the, the details and the nitty-gritty of your life and your work.
And, , there's a clear resonance between, what we do. So I'm gonna start by saying where are you in the world?
Brea: Okay. [00:02:00] So I'm on Vancouver Island right now. I have been here more or less for about a month or so, but this is where my farm is. This is where my permaculture regenerative farm is, and that me and my family have had since 2014.
And we mostly live in Costa Rica, though. So we are on the Pacific side of Costa Rica, and then back on the farm for smer.
So anyways, it's nice to, to chat with you, and it brings me back into some old memories- Yeah ... from Australia some, what, 20, nearly 20 20
Alena: years ago. Well, it's great to chat with you too. I'm, I'm coming at you from what is now called Sydney, but is really what I'm on is the saltwater, freshwater sandstone country, and I'm- Wow
on the northern beaches of Sydney, but, but a little bit back from the coast, so right on the fringe of this incredible area of just bushland. It's really beautiful. Wow. So I get very lucky. I'm very fortunate to have [00:03:00] city life, but also natural life around me at the same time. And the ocean, of course, the Pacific just down the road, which is such an incredible thing.
It's whale season, and lots of whales going past. It's just an awesome place to live.
Brea: I have a little crack at the ocean from, from where I am.
I'm p- perched up on the side of a mountain- I see ... overlooking what's called the Saanich Peninsula off of Vancouver Island, and we do have whales come in, into there. But I actually probably see more when I'm in Costa Rica, so they're just- Yeah ... it's just right in the middle of their migration zone and, and quite easy to see from the, the Pacific beaches there too, so.
Anyways-
Alena: So why Costa Rica? Because Costa Rica is a country that has a very, very high percentage of national park land, is my understanding.
Brea: Mm-hmm. Right.
Alena: So I'm curious why you chose to go there.
Brea: Well, I mean, it's like how deep do I go into this question? -
Alena: As deep as you like.
Brea: , W- the catalyst for [00:04:00] going to Costa Rica was during COVID.
So , I think Australia experienced it a lot like Canada experienced it, and my children were... I think my son was eight. I wanna say my daughter was around 11 at the time. And I just, I just didn't want them to stop being kids. That's the best way I can describe it. I didn't want them to have to worry about all of the things that were going on off of our farm.
. And I, I just wanted them to still be hands in the dirt, and being a mess, and being around kids, and just getting to be children. And so, , sometimes you just get a feeling about things, and- Yeah ... my feeling was, "We're going south." I don't... Nicaragua, Costa Rica, Mexico. I, I don't know. And when that thought came, it wasn't that...
it wasn't too long after that that my husband was talking to a friend of his in Nashville, Tennessee- And was similar and like, "Well, we're going to this place [00:05:00] called Nosara, Costa Rica, and we've sold our house. We're moving there in a week. We found an amazing Montessori school." Wow. "And it's nature-based, and it's incredible, and theater, and singing, and, and that's where we're going.
And, and there's surf there." And I happened to be walking by as they're having this conversation on the phone, and I'm like, "Nosara? That's the place." And it was really that. We moved five weeks later after that. Ooh, that's amazing. So we just organized everything on our farm, with our businesses, we were there for October- Yeah
of whatever that, that year was. I can't remember. Five years ago. Amazing. 2020. I really have to thank the catalyst for making that happen. And I'm not saying that, , I love Costa Rica. The ease of living in certain ways is incredible. There's also a lot of heat to deal with.
There's... It's a cultural difference. There's a lot of learning and integration and learning another language, and I'm still... My kids have picked up extremely easily. I, not so much.
, But .. it was more [00:06:00] like at that time, and again, I think still is, is finding a place that feels like the right place to raise my kids and to be in community. Yeah. And we landed in that place thinking, "Hmm, maybe s- maybe six months. We'll just see how this is." And, and now it's been five years.
Alena: That's amazing. And so talk to me about, I mean, who you are and what you do. You know? Like, I'm also curious why now? Why are you getting on podcasts and telling your story now?
Brea: So probably for the same reason that I would tell the people that I work with, just be more of you, whatever that is.
Like, w- what is that? Is, is it more showing up and laughing and being funny? Is it, is it more painting? Is it more singing? Is it more gardening? Is it more hard work and building stuff? Is it more volunteer? Like, whatever that thing is that's not work, that doesn't feel like you have to [00:07:00] try to do something, is just another way of you expressing yourself.
And, , and talking in front of groups is something that is just natural to me, and wasn't always, by the way. It was something that I really- I was extremely shy as a child. I think this is why I liked... found, I found alcohol is partly why I probably like that so much. Mm-hmm. Hence the, the time in Australia.
. And I just... But there was something about that that was always sort of okay, in an honest way, in a truthful way, not in a- Yeah ... a way that's, like, trying to show off or there's a mask on it or I'm trying to sell something. My client list is full. It's, it's not that at all. It's just... And so this is actually why I started my own podcast, which only, only just, like, a month ago.
It was one of those things that was sort of percolating in the background for a couple of years, and finally I was like, "You j- you just need to do that." So- I did, and it is effortless. And [00:08:00] talking with you is effortless. And I want to also continue to grow and to listen to my, whatever we wanna call it, internal heart, internal knowing of what that is.
And I have no idea where that leads to. I have no idea where this conversation leads to. I have no idea where my podcast leads to. I have no idea when I run a retreat where that leads to. But it's more about following- Yeah ... that knowing and that sense that this is, this is how I feel like I wanna show up in the world for others.
And obviously now doing, not podcasting you or showing up here talking, a newer thing. Yeah. But doing retreats, uh, working in the way that I do with people now for, for many, many years, , has just allowed that to continue to unfold. And I think it's one of the my most favorite things to work with people, whether that's in a group or individually, is when their life gets to be a reflection of themselves in a truthful [00:09:00] and honest way, that becomes effortless.
Yeah. I do not mean it's easy. I do not mean there's no more struggles or hard things.
Alena: I understand that distinction. I do understand- Yeah ... that distinction. Yeah. That's a hard one to convey.
Brea: It
Alena: really is. The distinction between effortless and easy. It's v- it's like, it's not easy, but it's effortless. That's, you know.
I get you. Yeah. Right? And- But that's, I think that's an experiential learning. I actually don't think that's something that can be described in words or by somebody else for you. I think this is something we experience.
Brea: I really agree with that, and I think a lot of, you know, when I'm having language with my clients, it...
And I mean you being somatically based too. Using, getting beyond the words. I will say, you know, beyond the words. We're just sensing, it's knowing, and if we're not knowing or sensing, that also doesn't matter. It, it just doesn't matter. It's still information.
Alena: It still is an, it still is an experience. Yeah.
Yeah.
Brea: And that's the part I think we're beginning as hanity learning to [00:10:00] trust and to get to know a lot more, so that when things cross your plate, like- Yeah ... oh, do you wanna join Alena's podcast for an hour and chat? Yeah. And it's like, it, it's just a, it's, it's not even like a brain yes, right? It's like, "That sounds lovely."
Mm. It's a feeling, yes. "That, that sounds great." And I, and I think that's, that's where that ease is. And, and I think-
Alena: Mm. Agree ...
Brea: we start to have more of that in life and in our quote unquote jobs or raising our children or in partnerships, relationships, and, and that's where I, I'm trying to allow myself to explore and drop into more and more all the time.
Speaker 2: quick interruption to say this podcast is brought to you by the Clear Ground Program. A somatically based multimodal online and live call program that is incredibly effective in helping you to connect within and between in your relationships, heal from the things that hold you back, and getting you to that place of thriving and clarity, grounded and [00:11:00] supported.
Participants are imagining a life that is bigger, more aligned. , There's a dream that they would like to bring to life, and this is what I absolutely love to support , and I have seen it happen again and again, people stepping into their biggest visions for their lives. It is a beautiful, heart-driven community.
So follow any of the links in the show notes or just get in touch with me through alenaturley.com, A-L-E-N-A-T-U-R-L-E-Y.
Alena: I realized. That's my one kind of- deal breaker. Like, , if you're not being yourself, or if I f- if I feel like this person has an agenda is maybe a better way to say it.
Brea: Yeah.
Alena: I'm, I have a bit of an aversion to that, you know? And this is an interesting moment I think in the world , right? Because-
Brea: Mm-hmm ...
Alena: authenticity, as you've talked about in your work, as I do in my work, being us, , just showing up as who we are.
Like, I believe that's basically what we have. It's, it's basically all we have, you know? And [00:12:00] everything else is kind of linked to that, is linked to our ability to be in some form of alignment with our hearts, with our souls, with our mission during this life. Not perfectly, but just somewhere around that, you know?
Brea: Yeah.
Alena: And I really have become, I've noticed now, less tolerant to, , a, a lack of that, a distinct- lack of that. I'm far less tolerant to it,
Brea: I think everybody is. I think- I agree ... and I think this is cr- I think is, this is the best news is one, we've been inundated with it with social media.
So we have been so inundated with the facade of whatever we're supposed to think, buy, feel, whatever that message is, that we're burnt out from it, and I think there's this, has a, it's a bigger shift, we could call it, happening- Yeah ... as more and more humans become aware of, of that truth and what we want.
And I think, you know, we're already starting to see there's newer trends, [00:13:00] of support for smaller, truthful, honest- ... shopping, uh, whatever, interactions, communities, uh-
support for each other, networks in all, in all the ways. And I think we're just starting to see the sprouts of that emerge. A lot of it's been so- Yeah ... underground. I, , you've of course felt that where you are in Australia. - I'm aware of that on my farm, , and that. Yeah. But now it's like, just coming up,
Maybe you're noticing this with the people you work with too, but, people, they wanna be honest themselves, and some people don't even know what that is at first. They're just like, "I can't do this. Whatever I'm holding," and I was certainly one- ... of those people. You're holding this thing on us.
Yeah. And it's like, "I can't do this anymore." But I s- everyone feels like that, or most people really feel. So even if they don't know what to do with that or where to go with that, they're just like, "I can't anymore." I think whatever was that was grasping, holding, is breaking down.
And of course, what's left at first is raw and it's honest [00:14:00] and it can be vulnerable and it hurts, and it's difficult getting to know how to maneuver in this new way. But I think people are more aware than ever, as you are. Like, if you're talking to somebody or if you're looking on social media and the person is saying something that doesn't align with their emotions or whatever else is in their field, you're just, you just know.
We do sense
Alena: it. I actually think, we are vessels in a way. , - We're just energy vessels in so many ways. Mm-hmm. For, for want of better language. But, we are, attuned. We're, we're made- ... to be. And so I think it's really interesting when we perceive that that is the truth for us as human beings, kind of how we're made, is to, is to sense.
We are sensory. And so when we sense, and this is not what someone is saying to us, this is a feeling or a, I don't know, just a sense, , that something is out of whack, w- we notice it. Yeah. We're designed- ... to notice it. We're designed to pick up on that. And, , I think the tricky part is that [00:15:00] you don't always realize that you are in that space when you're in it.
You know? Yeah. I certainly didn't. Like, when I was in a pla- and I'm not saying I'm perfectly not ever in that place. I'm so- ... imperfectly doing this, it's ridiculous, right? Some days more than others I'm able to just show up as who I am and, and let that be what it is, and other days I'm gonna try a little harder still, you know?
And then catch myself maybe playing a little game or pretending something. I don't know. I d- I don't think I do that so much now, but I do sometimes sense that something is happening, and maybe I'm masking something or, feeling like- Mm-hmm ... I need to hold back or whatever. And I think when you're in that by default, you don't realize.
You know, part of it- .. is there's a level of self-denial, that keeps you there. I know you had- ... your own journey to, I do use that word with a tongue in my cheek, but, like, the journey. You know? The journey to, to the place you're in now. [00:16:00] And- Mm-hmm ... I think it started when you went to Africa.
Can you talk to me a bit about that?
Brea: Africa, yes. I went there at the end of 2007. So I'd been doing a merger and acquisition work throughout Vancouver, and that sense that you were talking about of just knowing, knowing things had made me... That was always really strong in me since I was a kid. So I was working and doing things far beyond my years from a very young age.
And because I hadn't gone through any sort of, um W- I, I shouldn't say any, but not enough internal work to be like, "I also don't need to drink, and I'm also don't have to be in fear of, , having to make all this money to be safe." Yeah. , Everything was still external, if that makes sense. Yeah. I was aware of my internal, but I still- Yeah
I would, listen to that for, , half an hour a day, and the rest of the day was on make [00:17:00] money, show up, work, travel, wow people at work because I know what's happening, I can describe corporate finance and what needs to happen in businesses- Yeah, like what we're sup- ... and all the things ...
Alena: we're supposed to do that, right?
Yeah. , To achieve and succeed and-
Brea: And then 2007, I, was just like, "I can't do this anymore." I felt like I was living a lie. How probably many of the people I work with now feel. I was just like, "I can't do this. I hate my life." , That would be my- Yes ... that would've probably been my descriptive word.
I was probably depressed, but I certainly wasn't gonna go talk to a doctor about it. I was drinking to mask it. I was in unhealthy relationships. I was working 12 hours a day. And so I decided to go to Africa. , Some things were happening there. I w- ended up in Nairobi, and some things were happening there politically at the end of 2007, so expats had to leave.
I ended up on the island of Zanzibar, which for those of you that don't know, it's off the coast of Tanzania. And [00:18:00] one thing led to another, and before a short period of time, I was working for an NGO there, which was t- a couple who was an hour away from the place that I grew up on Vancouver Island. And they- That's crazy
had started this thing in the middle of nowhere, and this is before... , i, my understanding is now Zanzibar is extremely built up, and I, I don't know if I'd recognize it. , It's a different place. Yeah. But this is where there was very few people. And, , so I knocked on their door and I said, , "Do you need a teacher?"
They had a college, a business college, and of course, I've just been in business world, and they had a clinic there on site, , which I also needed. Yeah. And, , , and they were like, "Yeah." And so I just, , moved my bags from... walked back to grab , my little suitcase from an hour- Amazing ... down the beach.
So this was now 2008, '. But- There was dial-up internet. So essentially, I would maybe dial up internet once a week to tell my family- ... and friends that I was [00:19:00] alive. I was cut off from-
...
Brea: The other world, so to speak, and this was the biggest blessing I ever could have had.
Everything melted away. No, no obviously drinking, no ability to get away from whatever was happening in my internal world. , I was either with my students or I was f- I would call it floating on the, in the Indian Ocean. I would swim out for about 20 minutes, and I would lay on my back, and I would spend an , hour and a half just floating in the ocean.
Alena: Oh, sounds blissful.
Brea: And I just, all the things, all the visions, all the knowings, all those things that I had since I was a kid and had c- kept coming into my life over and over that I just kept shutting down or would pay a bit attention to, I just let that all be. And without expectation.
I had nobody- ... to talk to about, right? I wasn't trying to prove anything to anybody. This was just five months of my internal dropping in with nothing to prove, nothing to [00:20:00] do, no timeframe other than showing up for my classes and being with my students. And I, that was just the best thing ever.
And I remember, , 'cause I was still paying rent in Vancouver. I'd only expected to be away for, like, three or four or five weeks, so I was like, "Oh, and then I'll get back to the grind, and this'll be a nice reset." So I have, like, my car in Vancouver, my condominium that I'm paying for, my insurance. , I have all these expenses.
And my dad, and this is, , I gotta say, this is one of those things where you- This is what happens, right? When we really just start to trust and let it all go. My dad, um, I talked to him on the phone one day, and, , you know those old cards you would get with the numbers and you would to make a very expensive phone call.
.
Brea: And he was like- Yeah,
Alena: that's right ...
Brea: he says to me, "I don't think you're probably ever gonna get married." By the way, I think I was only 28 at this time, but anyways. Oh, right. "And your sister has, and I had some money that I gave to her for the wedding." Oh. "Would you, like that?" [00:21:00] And I was like- That's cool
"Thank you so much." So I was able to continue to... 'cause that was, like, the one little thing I was, like, a little bit worried about, like h- how does that kind of all happen? I- Yeah ... I just, I'd left, and I wasn't gonna get on a plane to go sort all that out. , And so things like that just started happening, and I guess the biggest thing, other than the internal complete overhaul, I don't even know , how to...
There wasn't a moment. I could remember moments upon moments of laying in the ocean, and I can remember- Yeah ... moments upon moments of watching the lightning on the sand at, like, 10:00 at night- Wow ... and the beauty. Those moments I remember. ... And I remember everything fading away, and my nervous system just this palpable, , realization of okay-ness within me, and that I wasn't holding.
, And I think this is what- It's an incredible- ... a lot of people experience in Al- ... realization though, isn't it? When you stop holding. . When you're holding, you don't realize you're holding, which is what you were describing before. And then when you stop holding- you're like, [00:22:00] "Whoa." Like-
.
Brea: You feel that. And, , and the clinic on site, as it would happen, my now husband shows up there. He was an acupuncturist, and he was coming to do, , I won't go into all the details, but to do a little one-month internship there. Oh. And this is how we met. , He was from the US, but he was also living in the same town.
This is how he ended up there. He had met the owners of the NGO in Victoria on Vancouver Island, and so that is how he ended up there. Wow. And so we ended up anyway shortly thereafter getting married, , , and life changed rapidly. , But that all came from that sense of surrender, of letting go, of complete honesty.
There's, there's- Yeah ... nothing to hold onto. There's nothing to prove. There's n- no expectations. There's n- the, I'm just being me in the messiness that I am and letting that all just be. , And so yeah, that was , a pivotal moment.
Alena: It sounds like a much more glamorous [00:23:00] pivotal moment than mine.
Brea: What was yours?
Now I, I have to know.
Alena: I don't know. Maybe you'll have to have me on your podcast- ... and I can share mine with you. Okay,
Brea: okay. Okay. We'll do that.
Alena: , It's a long story, but, , but I love that. What an incredible story. And look, your dad did pay for you to get married, just in a completely different way.
Brea: In a completely different way. And I also should say that that was, like, the lovely release letting go pivotal moment. . But I don't learn easy, so there were other pivotal moments that would come after- Surely there were ... where I I would ramp everything back up into a nice tight ball again- , yeah
in a slightly different way, , and h- really have more of the ass-kicking pivotal moments where you're like, "Oh God-" Yeah ... , i have to let go or, yeah.
Alena: So why do we? , My, I'm asking a why question. I don't like asking why questions sometimes, because why , is a brain thinking question, but I'm asking why at a deeper level.
What led to, maybe is a better way to say it. [00:24:00] What led to you being that great ball of achieving and ignoring your body's signals? And , I wanna instantly think about generational inheritances of emotional patterns, and, , that's where I go, , but how do you make sense of that?
Brea: Well, I think it's , all of it.
I think it's the unspoken energetic words of society telling us how we have to be, how we have to live, how we have to work. Our financial systems, our healthcare systems, they're systems- Yeah ... as in they're struct- they're structures outside of ourselves- Yeah ... that don't respond to those- Yeah
innate pieces of knowing and innate wisdom that we each hold within us. Yeah. So I think from the very beginning, whether that's through, , our ancestors, , our DNA, our structures, how our... We were raised from even being in utero- Yeah ... and what we were feeling at that [00:25:00] time. - Yeah ... all of it, and I don't think actually spending even a lot of time to figure that out , is even that necessary, because it- Agreed.
... It's like we get stuck then in the brain over what was the thing.
Alena: Agreed. Yeah.
Brea: A- and then we try to make sense of it , and
Alena: there's just no way. And it's just another rabbit hole. Yeah.
. So knowing that's the context, and really I'm leading- ... to something else, which is, , what's the antidote?
So not everybody can go to Zanzibar and float on the ocean, ? , So what's the antidote for the mere mortals who are still in the system, who don't live- Yeah ... on a permaculture acreage on Vancouver Island, ? The, those of the, the majority of humans who are by necessity living in the system,, how do you support them?
Brea: So I think that when somebody makes the choice of, "I can't do this anymore," that's that surrender, right? That's that surrender point. Yeah. And this is why I think a lot of us have to be, for lack of a word, taken to our knees, right? Like, just- become [00:26:00] balls of nothing. Literally. I remember
Alena: that moment.
Like I remember the moment of literally being on my knees.
Brea: I've had one maybe two of those too that I can recall. . When you do that, when you give up, you're not just giving up like giving up, you're giving up your identity to what you thought that was supposed to be, what it was supposed to look like, and that starts to leave.
And as the identity starts to leave, there's more space, and in that spaciousness, I believe that doors open up. This is where pathways start to open. Yeah. I talked about two that just happened in Zanzibar, but , yes, that sounded romantic and everything, and it was, but the other times in my life were not.
They were extremely excruciating, painful. But even that decision I made to go to Africa, that was made from that point of , "I can't do this." And it was a big deal for me to say , "I'm giving up my career, my safety net, my money, my everything to go on this unknown trip." Like that was- ... it was a, it was me choosing to leave the system, and I didn't know what [00:27:00] was on the other side of it, and I clearly had no idea that I would let, stay there and someone was gonna give me a little bit of money to cover my rent while I was away.
Yeah. So this is what I mean, and I don't mean that we should have an expectation that money's gonna come in. Again, we just, that's that same loop. , Yes, but if I had some money, I could... It's not. It has nothing to do with- yeah. I agree with that ... any of that. I totally agree. I think we have to open.
Alena: . , It's, , taking, action scared and uncertain for sure. Like , with the feelings of I don't know what's gonna happen, but I know- Yeah ... I gotta do something. Like, that's a really, really powerful, that like I'm fed up, I can't cope with this anymore, really, really powerful motivator, I reckon.
Brea: Mm-hmm.
Alena: Not just motivator, but lever for change. And then that, that surrender you talk about it, the leap, you know, the leap when you don't know what's on the other side, there's something in that. There's a great book about that actually called The Big Leap. It's fantastic.
. Yeah. , But I think , there's a lot of ways that you can talk about that, and- There is definitely this [00:28:00] element of, like, I s- say this often with clients as well, especially the ones that say, "So tell me what you do in a session," or, "Tell me exactly what happens in a somatic therapy session."
And I say, "I can't tell you that because it's completely different for every single person how they will need me to show up in a session." There might be some commonalities that I can share, but everybody has a different experience, and therefore I will facilitate that differently for every single person.
, I can't give you a X, Y, Z, rundown. Yeah. , And that's the thing that we cling m- particularly when we feel unsafe, right? We cling to certainty, and structure, and control, and yet they are the first things we need to be able to release to take a step in a different direction.
Brea: Yeah.
Alena: And that's the conundrum, isn't it?
It's so hard ... I'm terrified, but also I know it's the only way. Mm. And I feel like it's when you get to that point of utter desperation that you can just [00:29:00] suspend for a split second the need for control, the need for- Mm. Because you're desperate. You know, that desperation. Yeah. And I hate to say that, but I do think that Buddhist idea of suffering is the only way to enlightenment.
You know, desperation- ... is probably the only thing that when you're really clinging will make you stop clinging, you know?
Brea: Mm.
Alena: And that, what you just talked about, the, the giving up, I think you said giving up, I sometimes feel like it's a giving over. Like, that- ... it's trust. It's like trust- ... in something bigger than us, or trust in life, or trust that no matter what happens we'll be okay, ?
And of course- Yeah ... it's not always true, but it's like that trust is the prerequisite. Because if you're holding the reins too tightly, it can't happen. , I remember feeling that around men, like holding the reins, being in love and heartbroken, and all I wanted was, , that person back in my life or that life back.
And of course, I had no control over that. [00:30:00] And that feeling of absolute desperation, you know, it's a very powerful moment. There's a lot of moments like that- ... you know, in our lives where as humans there's nothing we can do, you know, to change something external to us. And, um, it's a very, I don't know, there's a lot of grace in that moment in some ways to me.
Brea: Mm-hmm. '
Alena: Cause it's when life- Yeah ... requires you to let go, and that's like, and like you say, creates space, creates room to breathe, creates something different somehow.
Brea: Mm-hmm ...
Alena: I think. I'm speaking- Yeah ... abstract. Very abstract. But-
Brea: It makes- ... talk to me- ... absolute sense ...
Alena: talk to me about your work. How do you work in this area?
How do you help other people with this?
Brea: Well, probably very similar to you by the sounds of the very short amount of time I've, I've known you, but it's very similar. I don't have an agenda for a session with a client, and because of that... So I think, [00:31:00] I gotta say something else. I think in the healing industry, quote-unquote, which I guess we're in, but I would never- Yeah,
I don't like saying that either ... call myself a healer. By default. Yeah. Is that we have, we've decided that either the person with us should be responsive, so our therapist, our energetic healer, our whatever, should be responsible for our healing. And the person in that place has also decided that they're responsible for the person's healing, quote unquote- Mm
for those that are- So not my work- You know what I mean? ...
Alena: but I know
Brea: what you mean.
Alena: And- Yeah, yeah, yeah ...
Brea: and, and I think this has been the tragedy of what we've seen in this industry- Yeah ... for, for a few decades now, , or maybe longer. Yeah. , But certainly since I've been aware of it. And that never sat very well with me, , because one, I don't believe anyone else can heal us.
W- I believe we can go [00:32:00] through what we've both just described, and that allowance, and we can get to know ourselves in a different way. And I think that our wisdom and that connection to Earth, to Source, whatever, what, wherever word we wanna call for that, is flowing within us, and that's accessible.
But we have, that's our own journey. That's our own personal thing. And, but we can work with people that can help us feel safe enough to explore that or develop that trust, as you were saying, within ourselves a lot more. When we have someone healing us, quote unquote, they are using their minds. They, it's being, even if the best and most beautiful and loving intentions, it's being filtered through the mind of what that person needs to experience.
So if I went to somebody and they were, you know, and I was like, "Oh, I'm, I'm suffering from depression," and they go right into their head, "I think you need to do this, and I'm gonna move some energy this way, and then I'm gonna give you this, and we're gonna do [00:33:00] that, and, and there's, this is the structure and this protocol, and we're gonna do this for 10 weeks, and then you're gonna be fine," that's all stuff that they learned from somebody else that's in the mind, that's in the head.
That is, might give me some temporary relief, and that might feel nice, and it might be great to talk to someone and to feel good with somebody for some time, so there's some value in that. I don't wanna say there's not value in that. But I mean, to really come and to know ourselves and to live from that truth within ourself, which by the way, has the effect of Our health often feeling a lot better in general, from physical to mental to spiritual, you know, all of the things, emotional.
It comes from a different place, and I think we should be empowering each other and h- and being with each other in a way that, uh, facilitates that so that w- we're not, I'm not reliant on a client or a person, a patient, to come back to me, and they're not reliant to have to come and see me to feel [00:34:00] okay.
Absolutely. And so this is the dynamic that we've really set up, and we've... I think we've disempowered ourselves in- I agree ... you know, in this respect, and we're disempowering the people that we're trying to help because they don't realize that it's really all within them. So- Mm ... much like what you said, my way is to just be there.
My nervous system probably has a more developed sense of safety than a lot of people's does, but it's not 'cause I'm telling them that. They're just sensing that, and that sense is going, "Oh-" Yeah ... "it's safe. I can go into my own world" in whatever way that means, by the way. Like, who knows what that means in a session?
I don't know. But it- Yeah ... it gives them that empowerment and that safety and that place to be able to get to know and that, that trust of their own whatever that is inside of themselves. So, so that's how I work, and whether that's in a, a one-hour session or that's in a retreat where we dive into that even deeper over a number of days and we work with all those different things that come into life and really feel it, be with [00:35:00] it, it's so, it's so simple, but the simplicity is what makes it so difficult because we have been so taught that everything has to be difficult and hard, and we're not gonna be able to do it.
Mm. And so I think we just keep holding, and we keep holding, and we keep holding.
Alena: Yeah, that's so interesting. That
Brea: was a long-winded answer. Sorry.
Alena: I'm so glad you said all of that because this is incredibly refreshing for me, um, to hear another person speaking about these things. I think they're not spoken about very often.
And-
Brea: Mm ...
Alena: , i, I'm struggling to know where to begin responding to what you just said. What I wrote down was, "Broken to be fixed," that one of my issues I have with a lot of the forms of healing that we hear about, also in inverted commas, "healing"- Yeah ... is that it presumes, , for somebody who's coming into- To heal you, then that presumes that you are unhealed to [00:36:00] begin with.
It presumes- ... that you are broken to be fixed, and that I, that really bugs me. . Because I don't believe that's true. I believe that we adapt, and I believe that every single adaptation that we make in our lives occurs for a really good reason, and our nervous system did it for a reason, and our emotions hid themselves for a reason, and that we need to trust that.
We need to trust the wisdom in that, and often we don't, and often a lot of the modalities that come up in the, the spaces that you and I work in don't trust that. And, um, really bugs me because it, number one, says, "Well, you're broken. I just need to fix you." Number two, the issue is power, that it takes all the power away- Yeah
from you and your own ability to connect within. So I often talk about power over and power within, power- in is what I'm interested in, [00:37:00] and power in is what got me two black belts as a martial artist. Power in is how we come into our own and have the courage to show up as who we are, is by tapping- Yeah
into that power within us. So when we are given the impression that that power does not live within us, it lives in other places, and spaces, and people, um, that's tricky for me, and it's ethically tricky as well for a lot of reasons.. But also, I wanna be obsolete. , I don't wanna see a client-
forever. I don't want them to give me money for something that I'm just- Yeah ... doing to them, I don't think that's real, and I don't think it's, quite frankly, ethical. So I think this is a really interesting time and place to be living in and doing the work that we do, Bree.
Because-
There is somehow some recognition and some appreciation for the types of approaches that you and I are taking now, slowly but surely? Then the, [00:38:00] most importantly, the effectiveness of that, of just like- ... I'm gonna sit here beside you, and together we're going to experience what needs to be experienced, and we're gonna help you move through this moment.
I'm gonna help you connect again with what is already there, and has always been there.
Brea: Yeah.
Alena: It's really powerful. , So I, I just real- it's really nice to hear someone else talking about that. Thanks.
Brea: Yeah. , I, I just, yeah, I agree with everything you said, and I... think we have to realize how much gets interpreted and filtered through our brain, and that- Yeah
we're putting that onto each other, and that's not- ... really where this deep wisdom is, right? It lives beyond words within us. It lives in that infinet- infinite connection within us, and, and we don't really have the words to describe it. And so if we're healing, or facilitating, or whatever that is, [00:39:00] and we're really coming through the mind of our projections of what...
if I had my projection of what I think your healing path is going to be or should be, I'm actually- Yeah ... really, yes, disempowering you, as you said, , and it's also really could be quite energetically distorting to your path. Yeah. Because I'm kind of- moving my brain and my energy towards you in that way.
And I think that's really what I see a lot of people doing. And , when I come- Yeah ... when a lot of people come to work with me, and they can be, , some are, come from this, this world of, of some sort of quote, unquote, "healing , work."
,
Brea: Sure. , And I explain, or I even was asked on the podcast, ", what do you do?"
I'm like, ", I just show up as myself." Yeah. But showing up as myself was the hardest thing to be able to do, if that makes sense. Absolutely. , It's, it, it's so simple and easy now in a way, but it was to be sh- to show up as our authentic self around other people is extremely hard, , because we don't realize how inda- inundated [00:40:00] we have been by- Yeah
all of the other, the other expectations, beliefs, patterns, systems. . And so it's, you know, being able to dismantle that in a way that's also not hyper-fixated on that, because that we have- Yeah, ... like that we were talking about earlier, we don't really need to fixate on that. But it is a recognition that's there, and I think when we have that awareness of that, it dis- it disintegrates on its own.
. While we're simultaneously getting to trust ourselves in a different way, that we're probably never gonna have words to be able to articulate fully, or at least-
...
Brea: Not right now. And maybe that comes in years or decades ahead.
Alena: , I agree. And I think the, the hint is in how it feels. Like-
Generally speaking, when I leave a session, I feel energized. I feel, , expanded. You know, I'm excited and, um, uplifted, I guess. Yeah. Again, , it's an experience. It's something that I sense, you know? And, and , it's funny [00:41:00] sometimes hearing, someone might learn a particular modality. I do use one particular modality that is quite structured.
There's a lot of room in that structure for- maneuvering however we need to maneuver with the person around what's going on for them. But it's a really interesting, um, thing, 'cause some people learn it and maybe don't have lived experience of trauma, or don't have lived experience of, experientially moving through those sorts of things.
And so you can see they get stuck on the structure, and it's, and it's harder for them to allow whatever happens in the session to unfold. , And it's fascinating, and then they say how exhausting it is. "I'm feel exhausted and I'm worried about, , seeing three or four clients in a day and not being able to manage it energetically."
And I'm like, "That's so interesting, 'cause I don't feel drained- Yeah ... by my
Brea: sessions." Absolutely.
Alena: Right?
Brea: And I think
Alena: I- That's a hint to you, I think.
Brea: It is. If, yeah, I think if people are listening and you're drained after you work with somebody- Yeah ... it's because y- you probably think you're responsible for healing them, or-
Alena: Right
Brea: they [00:42:00] have set themselves up s- or somehow perceive from you that you're responsible for healing them. Right.
Alena: Agreed.
Brea: Or you're putting everything into them- Yes ... which again is, like, where is that putting in coming from? Is- Yeah ... is that true, or is that from what you learned somewhere that that's how that should be- Yeah
and what that should look like?
Alena: Yeah.
Brea: And, , women that, um, I'm saying women, I have men's and women's retreats, but- Yeah ... but women always notice this, um, in a retreat setting, 'cause they'll work with me for six days, and like, "Oh, you must be so tired," and, at the end of it. , Absolutely not.
Like- Same. ... if I was tired, I shouldn't be doing this. I'm looking forward to getting back with my kids, and I'm looking forward to that. But, but this, and so when we're showing, and I think you're experiencing that same thing, when we can really show up and be like, "Yeah, this isn't...
It's not exhausting, and it shouldn't be. But neither should who's ever there in, in front of you." . "Your work shouldn't be exhausting either, and if it is, let's- Yeah ... let's work from there. Let's figure out what's really going on there." Yeah. Um, [00:43:00] and this is true for... I mean, if I could ma- ... if I could just wave my magic wand, I'd be like, we would all show up-
in this world and do what we want to do. I know. Create from where would be effortless. And this doesn't matter- .. like, there... I know, I know people that love jobs that I would... Like plumbing. I, I would be the worst plumber- . ... or electrician. Yeah. And, and some people love that job, and it's perfect.
. And other people don't. And do you know? And it's the same. So it's like doing those things that we can't imagine other people doing, but maybe the thing in us is like als- like one of the jobs I used to love was being a waitress, was serving. I'm like, if I didn't do this work, I'd probably be running a cafe or something like that.
You know? Like I also- ... love doing that. I like painting. I would be painting- ... , . , We have these things in us where we might have- , these preconceived ideas that we can know. We can't do that. Like, oh, if I paint- ... I won't make money or survive, or if I'm a server- and what sort of 47-year-old should be serving or whatever. Like, we have these [00:44:00] notions. Yeah. But this is where, that's where that opening is, where we go, "Yeah, but I'm just gonna do more of what I love and see where that goes. I don't know where that's gonna go." And this is- Yeah ... I think, where we have that opportunity to create and to move from a different place of ease.
Alena: Yeah. I agree. Yeah, that's right. It's such a beautiful thing when you realize that, I think. When you experience it and start to feel, I guess, held in that, and, and spacious enough to do that, and safe to do that, you know? That, that definitely does take some work for some of us. I know for me, it, it's taken a really, really long time to feel safe in it, and I'll still have days.
You know, there'll be weeks where maybe three clients cancel, you know? And I'll be like, "Oof" Am I okay? Like, am, am I going okay- Yeah ... with that, you know? And then I'm like, "Yeah, I am." And it's like I, I still check in. Am I making that about me? Am I making that mean that I'm not doing a good job? Am I... You know, I do a little [00:45:00] self-examination, 'cause that's my, that's my old wound.
Mm. I'll be like, "No, I'm a- I'm actually, I'm all right. I got some more time for the gardening today." You know, like, it's a really-
Brea: Yeah ...
Alena: it's a funny little game. And, and it, and it goes around and around, and each time it comes around and another layer heals. You know, those old betrayals, those old wounds, each time they come up, another layer heals.
It's like the work continues, you know?
-
Brea: Yeah. Yeah, and I think as you're describing it too, as we get used to those layers coming up- Yeah ... it becomes less and less of a big deal.
.
Brea: And so therefore it's not a big deal. And, and I think- Yeah ... this is what keeps us in the cycles for so long, is we just, we believe that it's a bigger deal than it actually is.
So it's not actually the problem itself that's the problem, it's the idea that a problem is a big problem.
Alena: And- And that's like a neural pathway. That's like a neuroplasticity as well. Yeah. You know, like we have the habit of, or the [00:46:00] experience of those feelings, those old wounds taking us out. You know, like- Mm
wreaking havoc, causing damage. And that, that in itself is really hard to navigate. You know? Yeah. It's really hard. And it also sets up a kind of a cycle, I think. Mm-hmm. And, and we can disrupt those cycles.
Brea: Mm-hmm. . Yeah, we really can. And, um, ah, it, uh, we... I know I was like this. I was just so serious about life.
Right. I was so serious.
.
Brea: And, and I think part of that trust that we're talking about too is realizing- ... just that, it's a little moment in time. And I know being human is incredible, and we get to have this experience, but I think part of the trust and the surrender is knowing truly, not with words, not from- Yeah
whatever we were told we were supposed to believe in, but something so deeper that becomes a visceral sense that-
Alena: ... Y-
Brea: you start to never feel disconnected from that. It, it almost seems [00:47:00] like an impossibility to be disconnected. Yeah. But I spent many, many years in sort of two worlds where I felt extremely disconnected, and I had that sense, but I couldn't bridge those two together.
Yeah. And it was extremely painful, and I think a lot of people are experiencing that too, 'cause I didn't use- Right ... very good words there, but people know what I'm talking about. Oh, you did. Yeah. And we know that, like, oh, how much that hurts when you feel like there's something and you know, but you're not quite- With that, you can't make those two worlds somehow get together I
Alena: remember it was like being split in two.
It was- Yeah ... I just found it excruciating.
Brea: Mm-hmm.
Alena: And I was blessed with a very low tolerance for that. I think I was too. It was really excruciating until I worked out- Yeah, yeah. ... I just can't, actually can't do that. It's actually not possible for me to do that. Oh my goodness. Um, thankfully. But also, I think this relies on finding the safety in your surroundings, like in the people, in the, the work, in the children, in the family, in the, you know, [00:48:00] all of the relationships that, um, I think about now that support me to be this person.
You know, I couldn't, I cannot underestimate that, to be held By what is around me, by, by what I've built, by what I've invested in, you know? The relationships that I invest in, like... Also, I just was really lucky. I got a great husband and great kids. Like, that, that's just, I feel like that's just really good fortune.
Brea: Anyways.
Alena: How old are your kids now?
Brea: Well, I think it... So my daughter's 16, and my son is 13. Right. But I think, I think a part of it is i- we sort of have to trust the path that we're on.
Alena: Mm.
Brea: And it's like for some of us, that is maybe an easier relation- relationship- Oh, yeah ... or, or, or just that innate, like, knowing how to show up for our children from the day they're born, or from when they're in utero.
Yeah. You know? And for others, it's other, it's other things, right? And it's- Yes ... it's really trusting, [00:49:00] because I think this is where we get into comparison so much. Yeah. And we're either hard on ourselves because we might have it easy in one area- Yeah ... or, or we're hard on others 'cause we think, "Well, they got it so easy in that area, too."
Mm-hmm. And, and it's really trusting our own journey and our own path, and I think that's that connection to something else. We're like, "Yeah, maybe I don't exactly understand why, why I was given the shit end in whatever department it was," you know?
Alena: Yeah.
Brea: But this is my, this is my journey, and this is my path.
Am I going to see it as a big problem, or make big problems out of it, or am I gonna realize that the problem itself is a lie, and that there's something else underneath of it? Yeah. And I think this is, you know, the bit of where we have that, that choice that has to be made, or doesn't have to be made, actually, because there's no- nothing also saying...
I don't think everyone in this lifetime has to figure shit out or any shit out. Do
Alena: you know, this is true. I actually have a theory about this. I think there's three- Hit me ... I, I'm gonna give you a three types of people- Okay ... analogy, [00:50:00] okay?
Brea: Yeah, yeah.
Alena: Wrongly or rightly, this is the way- ... I think about it. Um, there are the people...
I actually think about this most of all in relation to generational trauma. So there are the people who are highly attuned to a sense that they are carrying a weight that isn't theirs, right? There are the people who carry that weight, and maybe carry a greater load emotionally of the unfinished business from our culture, from our society, from our generations prior.
Mm-hmm. And those people feel more deeply, sense more deeply, um, carry that information more heavily often, like that seriousness you talked about, and have a lot of information to deal with as a result as well. You know, you're, you're sensing and perceiving maybe a little more than most. Um, but there's also in being that person a great opportunity to, I [00:51:00] guess, learn to carry that load more lightly, and process or- Make sense of or integrate perhaps some of that load over time and heal some- Yeah
of those wounds over time from multiple generations prior, and in doing so, multiple generations ahead. And that person is compelled. That person cannot live with that split. That person-
Brea: Mm ...
Alena: has to do the work, work out how to carry this load, more likely how to go through these healing processes for all the generations prior, all the generations ahead, and how to make it actually their gift, not their burden, right?
That's the grief bearer concept. It's a fantastic concept. And then there's the people who- Are aware of the load, and aware of the existence of the load, and can sense it's there, but they don't feel compelled [00:52:00] to do anything about it. So they have an awareness of it, they can sense it, it's a thing that they can notice, but they're not compelled to heal it-
Brea: Mm-hmm
Alena: for the past, for the future, for themselves, or step into a gift in relation to that. And then there are those who are completely oblivious and have no sense of this emotional load even existing-
Brea: Mm-hmm ...
Alena: and are not interested or compelled in any way to acknowledge that that e- even is a thing. And it feels to me like there's three types, and maybe those generations cycle as well, I don't know.
But like- ... it does often feel to me, I can sort of pick it sometimes when I meet someone. If I say something about this kind of deeper thought or deeper feeling, and like, "Mm, I don't know." You know, there's like that complete... I'm like, "Okay, that's just not for you. You know, it's not your medicine." Mm-hmm. And that's cool.
No worries, you know? And then there's others who go, "Yeah, I know what you mean. Doesn't really affect me, though." [00:53:00] That's number two, you know? And then, and then there's me- Yeah ... or maybe you, or maybe some others who- ... who feel it deeply and feel compelled to explore it, and maybe make it their life's work to help others to do the same, you know.
Brea: Mm-hmm.
Alena: So that's my three type of people theory. I don't even remember where I heard it. But it feels so true sometimes.
Brea: No, I like that, and, I think there's probably a lot of truth in that. And I think that's why, you know, because, because a lot of people will come to me, and they feel like they're carrying the weight of the world, and they're like, "I just, I want to fix everything for everybody.
I want to heal the-" Yeah. The words, you know. So, "I want to heal the world." They want to help everybody and fix everybody. And, you know, th- their part and their story aside of that, and it, and it's like- Yeah ... but, but we don't need to. That's not everybody's path-
is, is to live like that. And again, we get caught up in this notion of time, or like, [00:54:00] "My way involves that for me, so surely everybody else must have to go through there." Yeah. Come to their knees, and they're... And, and it's just, it's, it's not. It doesn't, it doesn't have to be in that way, or in a timeframe that we think it has to be, or how it has to look.
And so I think, yeah, again, as people in the healing world, if there's people, you know, thinking about it from that perspective, again, it comes with like, you're not responsible for other people's healing journey or their
Alena: path. 100%. It's a classic- Right? ... wounded healer thing, yeah.
Brea: Yeah.
Alena: Absolutely. It's an expression of a hurt to me.
Brea: Mm-hmm.
Alena: That, that thing, you know.
Brea: And a lot of people will s- really feel like, um- You know, one of my clients said to me the other day, "I, I have to volunteer more, so I'm gonna, I'm gonna do this volunteer work," and it was inner city work, "and I, I've gotta get in there more." And she's like, "But I really don't want to.
Like, I really don't like it." [00:55:00] "But my sister says I have to." Yeah. And I was like, "Okay. So- ... why is, why do you have to do that?" So, you know, and when we, we really got into it, of course there's something that she wants to do that is more of an expression of her, which in this case was dance. Mm. And it was like, who knows where that goes if you allow yourself to go to dance class an hour a week?
Yeah, that's good. Like, because now the energy you're putting out into the world is one that you're aligned with.
Alena: Mm-hmm.
Brea: Right? That is so different than going in to work with inner, inner city kids, and although it's beautiful work, you're not aligned with it. So the- Yeah ... now you're filling up a space where someone that could be in that space that's truly meant for that work- Yes
and is aligned with
Alena: that work- That's true ...
Brea: could be there and showing up in a way that would be a lot more impactful, and they're probably not gonna be so impactful doing an hour of dance, right? Like, so- ... again, [00:56:00] this idea of like it's not about being selfish. It's about being in alignment and listening to that, that other, that other voice.
And I-
Alena: An expression, expression of self, you know? Yeah. Expression of true self, like that kind of really true expression.
Brea: Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Absolutely. And, um, which, which comes back to our earlier conversation. Why on pod- I don't know. I'm just h- here. Yeah. Yeah. And I never thought that I would be, but that just feels like the right thing right now in this moment.
And, and I think if we all just let ourselves listen to that a, a little- Mm ... bit more, you know, a little bit more of drawing if you wanna draw. Yeah. Or- Yeah. I agree ... a little bit more cooking or baking if you wanna do that, or looking at the sunrise and sunsets. Just a little bit more of those things that are disconnecting from the, the addiction of devices or other vices, whatever those are.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. The ha- those things, and a bit more of, yeah, what lets us just be in our, [00:57:00] our awareness of our, of ourself, more a connection to Earth in whichever way that is. Movement, creation. I, I just- Mm ... like to look at the sunrise and the sunset every day, you know? Me too. And, and, and hike in the mountains, and get in the trees, and, and lay down when I feel like it- Yeah
on the earth. And, and- Yeah ... there's nothing fancy about that. It's just the simplicity of it. And I, I don't think I would've been able to get to that place because it would've been quite boring if I hadn't first let myself develop just- Mm ... that connection in that way, which I had from a young age, so I never really let go.
.
Brea: But it's so easy to feel a sense of boredom now, I think, because we're so used- Mm ... to having dopamine, serotonin always- Yeah ... feeding from our devices, and we're looking for that. Yeah. And now suddenly the sunset and the sunrise isn't so exciting, and especially if it doesn't have a filter on it.
Alena: .
Like, from our- I'm that classic person. I'm that classic therapist who'll be like- So are you, are you going for walks in nature? [00:58:00] And they'll be like, "Yeah, I walk in nature. I listen to podcasts. I da, da, da." I'm like, "No, but are you really connecting with the nature?" What's up? And they're like, "Yeah, sure, I go for walks."
I'm like, "But that's not the same thing," you know? Like, I'm trying... It's so funny. It's
Brea: not the same thing if we have music or a podcast on. And I
Alena: think like- It's not the same thing, and that's okay. Like, do that. I'm like, do that, sure. Um- But also do the one where you, you
Brea: know, connect I tell everybody I go to the gym a few times a week, right?
So I'm in there with everybody. Yeah. I go and, and I'm lifting weights. I'm listening to ridiculously trash 1990s- Yeah ... hip hop music on full blast. 100%. And that's, that's my moment. Those are my times to do it that way, right? Yeah. Like, 'cause it's fun and that feels good, and I'm there. Yeah. And I love it.
And then when I'm out- Yeah ... in nature, there's nothing. I'm just- That's it ... I'm there. And, and so we can do both. You don't have to, like, give it... Or you can- I say that too ... do half your walks with music and half your walks without. Like, there's a way- Yeah ... [00:59:00] to do, do both that's still honoring that part of you.
I
Alena: agree. I'm like, watch Love is Blind if you want to. Just don't watch it all day every day. ? Like, it's okay. , Just don't be so hard on yourself. Yeah. But also just give yourself some room for the other stuff too. ... It's all okay. Um-
Brea: No, I think it is imperative to reconnect with nature if, if we can.
Yeah. It just... I, I really do. I, I, I really think it is, and I don't think there's- ... really a way around that. And-
.. I think we have to take, we have to take our shoes off, and I think we have to get our feet out- Agree ... on the dirt.
Alena: Yeah. Yeah. I agree. Aw, Bri, it's been so nice to talk to you.
We've been talking for ages.
Ages, and I love it, and I also wanna say thank you so much for spending a little bit of time with me. It's been a real pleasure.
Brea: It's been so nice. Thank you so much. Yeah. , Yeah, I, I've loved talking to you. Obviously we have so much in common too. . So I'm looking forward to- Yeah
to more conversations. And yeah,
Alena: appreciate you so much. Yeah, same. Here's to new friends. And, ...
, find this lady. I'm gonna put all her information in the show notes.
And Bri, you go well this [01:00:00] evening, and thanks again.
Brea: Yes, thank you. Bye.
Alena: Bye. Ok
